What You Don’t Know About Online Dating. Season 6, Episode 23 On this week’s episode of Freakonomics Radio: an economist’s guide to dating online. PJ Vogt bravely lets us · Sugar Daddy Dating. Mar 22, A Freakonomics reader (we’ll call her “Sugar Baby”) is documenting her two-week experiment with online “Sugar Daddy Dating”: AdFind Your Special Someone Online. Choose the Right Dating Site & Start Now! AdCreate an Online Dating Profile for Free! Only Pay When You Want More Features! Make a Free Dating Site Profile! Only Pay When You're Ready to Start Communicating!Services: Dating Sites Comparison · Dating Sites Features · New Reviews · Online DatingTypes: Christian Dating · Senior Dating · All Ages Dating Sites · Gay Dating Sites ... read more
So in my case I was very upfront and forthcoming in my profile about the fact that I had a large and badly behaved golden retriever, and the fact that I have two teenaged children. Because if somebody was against those things, then those were deal-breakers.
Well, it did. He found his significant other on J-Date. A few weeks after they talked, I asked PJ how he changed his OkCupid profile:. VOGT: So generally the sense that I got from talking to him was that I came off as a flippant alcoholic. So, I was trying to diminish that. So I cut… I think, one reference to drinking.
VOGT: What I did…I answered…. he said I should fill out more of the basic questions about me. VOGT: Yes.
He told me to put in a picture of myself more presentable so I took a picture of myself from a wedding…. DUBNER: Oh yeah. And… what was your… it was a solo shot before… a little slacker-y….
VOGT: Yeah, I also, I put a picture with my dog. Which felt like the spirit of his advice. And a bunch of old ladies. DUBNER: Ok, so here we… Oh my god. You are canny! So this is actually a perfect mirror in a way of the other picture of you at the wedding with four young good looking girls. Now here you are on a park bench in what looks like Brooklyn, holding a dog, not just in your lap, but in your arms, like you have so much love to give but I have to give it to the dog because you are not here.
And there are four older women on the bench surrounding you looking as though, oh, if only I were forty years younger this would be the man of my dreams, or if he were forty years older. PJ also tweaked his profile a bit, as Paul Oyer suggested. He tried to highlight some of his best attributes…. DUBNER: I mean…look… it is hard for me to say, but I would think if I were a woman and any guy who talked about….
like, if he is listing his teeth as an attribute. A it feels vain. VOGT: Yeah, it would be like an apartment being like, we have a sink, we have a working sink. You should have a sink. So how did it work out for PJ? But the strengths of online dating are very real. And I imagine this is true in other ethnic communities. What are your job responsibilities? What do you think is the best contribution your job makes to society?
Also, my birthday is this Thursday and I would love it if you would shout me out on the show! Job responsibilities on the podcast? Basically, Levitt does the numbers, I do the words. Best contribution we make to society? Are you kidding? Have you ever listened to this podcast? And about your birthday?
Happy birthday, Katie Hoezler. And thank you for listening. Freakonomics Radio Network Newsletter Stay up-to-date on all our shows. We promise no spam. So this is when she got crafty.
She wrote a fake OkCupid profile. Very, very fake. DUBNER: So you set up a profile, and your name is what? REED: AaronCarterFan. DUBNER: And are you, in fact, an Aaron Carter fan? DUBNER: Why? DUBNER: Talk about some of your favorite highlights or lowlights of your profile. REED: LOL. Oh yeah. She really enjoys it. DUBNER: Right. DUBNER: So what do you attribute that success to? DUBNER: Uh-huh. And so tell me about following up with some of these replies.
DUBNER: And how many dates did you have then out of AaronCarterFan fishing? DUBNER: Really? REED: Yeah. DUBNER: I am so surprised, Alli. REED: Actually, I found that a deal-breaker for me was messaging AaronCarterFan. DUBNER: Okay. What else? DUBNER: All right.
OYER: Hi, how are you? VOGT: Good! Nice to meet you. VOGT: No! VOGT: Very transparent. OYER: Can I just ask the old guy question? What are torrents? VOGT: It could be that I was really into torrential rain. VOGT: Long walks in the rain. VOGT: Oh boy, B-A-R-T-H-E-S S-I-M-P-S-O-N. This is so mortifying. VOGT: Yeah, option value sounds like a good way to put it. OYER: Right now you should be very patient.
OYER: No, no, go ahead. VOGT: Yeah. VOGT: I mean, do you feel like the software does a good job of that? Coming up on Freakonomics Radio: how to build the best online dating profile ever: OYER: As an economist I look at that and I want to suggest the following, that you fill in more detail keeping in mind two ideas that are very important in economics.
And, why online dating is a bigger deal than you think: Justin WOLFERS: The Internet has turned matching upside down. VOGT: Oh man. OYER: Yeah, there you go, exactly. VOGT: Huh. VOGT: Okay. VOGT: Wait, so you think that I should have dressed up pictures? VOGT: Oh, please! A few weeks after they talked, I asked PJ how he changed his OkCupid profile: VOGT: So generally the sense that I got from talking to him was that I came off as a flippant alcoholic.
DUBNER: Which one? DUBNER: Did you change photos? He told me to put in a picture of myself more presentable so I took a picture of myself from a wedding… DUBNER: Can I see? And… what was your… it was a solo shot before… a little slacker-y… VOGT: Yeah, I also, I put a picture with my dog. VOGT: Yeah! VOGT: Public radio… relatively fun. Not depressed… Not… DUBNER: You have good teeth. VOGT: Thank you. I should put that in there. DUBNER: Yeah. Long story short: I signed up that afternoon, started with some e-mails and went on my first date from the site, not ever on Feb.
Tim and I have been inseparable ever since, bring each other endless amounts of happiness, and last night he proposed. I, obviously, said yes. We plan to elope in NYC this August, to avoid a large dramatic wedding.
But you and your families are welcome to join us. Part 2. I recently listened to your podcast on online dating and found it fascinating — not so much because of the economics of dating, but more how it contrasted and compared with the economics of the dating world I live in: the Orthodox Jewish semi-arranged marriages.
I grew up in upstate New York, in a village that is almost only Haredi Orthodox. The world I live in is sort of like Jane Austen , very marriage-oriented. Every girl and boy for that matter wants to get married, and does so in her early twenties. The systems at play to get everyone married off must fascinate an outsider. So far, only one girl is divorced. I know that the Orthodox Union has done research into the area. They collected a lot of data by surveying thousands of Orthodox couples, including Haredim , with in-depth online questionnaires.
While I have not examined their data and what a treasure trove that must be to an economist! I think that this success in matching quickly, efficiently, and happily is due to changing the incentives you talk about in your podcast.
The entire process seems to have been designed to reduce outer beauty from being the main incentive in a marriage market.
From Business Insider :. The ConvergEx folks, using data from statisticbrain. Writing for FP , Bethany Allen explores the role of dating sites catering to young Chinese Muslims:. In other words, they appear heavily Sinicized. Researchers led by Kang Zhao at the University of Iowa have devised a new matching algorithm for online dating sites.
In the online dating context, an algorithm can get a good idea of my taste in partners by doing a similar comparison of me to other male users. Another male user of the site will have a similar taste in women to me if we are messaging the same women. However, while this gives the algorithm a good idea of who I like, it leaves out the important factor of who likes me — my attractiveness to the female users of the site, measured by who is sending me messages.
They also divorced at a lower percentage:. The research shows that couples who met online were more likely to have higher marital satisfaction and lower rates of marital breakups than relationships that began in face-to-face meetings. This is the first time I have ever tried to use it play cupid. I have a close friend here in Chicago. She is in her late twenties. She is really smart. She has an extremely successful career. She is incredibly pretty.
Here is a true story. My wife later described her as the most beautiful woman she had ever seen in person. Why, if she is so great, is she still single? Also, I suspect a lot of potential suitors are intimidated by her — I know I would have been. A man would need to be very self-confident to ask her out. New research by Jochen E. Gebauer and two co-authors, summarized in the BPS Research Digest , analyzed data from a German dating website and found that an unpopular name will lessen your chances of getting a date in the online dating universe:.
The main finding here was that people with unfashionable names like Kevin or Chantal were dramatically more likely to be rejected by other users i. other users tended to choose not to contact them. A user with the most popular name Alexander received on average double the number of contacts as someone with the least popular name Kevin … However, the researchers also found that people with unpopular names were more likely to smoke, had lower self-esteem and were less educated.
Apparently, Kevin really is more than a name. Freakonomics is no stranger to studying prostitution , as discussed in Superfreakonomics. com auctions off dates and claims to be inspired by the charity dating model. Upon a cursory read, the generous users seem to be overwhelmingly male, and the attractive users overwhelmingly female and pictured in bathing suits. Even virtual roses used in Korean online dating experiments.
In a new working paper by main author Soohyung Lee of the University of Maryland , economists studied the impact on preference signaling — signals sent to a select few.
REED: And I just moved to L. in August and you know got back on as a way to meet people, and get to know the city a little bit. Reed is a comedy writer. She spent a lot of time on her OkCupid profile. REED: …got a lot of messages of, hey, you seem nice. Like, just nothing to do with my profile, and so I wondered does anyone care at all. Like are they just looking at a picture? So I wanted to see if there was a lower limit to how awful a person could be before men would stop messaging her on an online dating site.
REED: Well, Aaron Carter is the younger brother of a Backstreet Boy who had a brief and ill-advised rap career. And there is just no substance there in his music at all. And that was what I was trying to reflect in AaronCarterFan. DUBNER: Talk to me a minute about the six things you could never do without. Money, my car, my phone, keeping America American, my family, and my friends, and Aaron Carter. REED: She — to me, the worst person in the world is definitely racist.
And so I needed that to be a part of her. You know, I wanted her to be believably terrible. REED: AaronCarterFan did very well. In the first 24 hours, she got messages. I had the profile up for two or three weeks, and she got close to men message her. She got probably 10 times the number of messages that my real profile got.
I asked my friend Rae Johnston, who is an Australian-based model and actress if I could raid her Facebook photos and she very kindly said yes. And so Aaron Carter fan is stunningly good-looking.
REED: Well after so many messages started rolling in the optimist in me decided that these men had just seen the pretty photo and had not read her profile. So my goal at that point became to convince them that she is just awful. That she is the worst woman on earth. I would threaten to pull out their teeth. With a lot of guys I could just — I wrote gibberish, just pounded on the keyboard for a minute and sent it and the vast majority of them responded with that sounds great, what are you doing on Friday?
REED: I actually, believe it or not, did not want to meet any of these men in real life. Alli Reed wrote a fake OKCupid profile for a really good-looking year-old woman who also happened to be a racist, gold-digging, fake-pregnant-getting nightmare — and she got almost 1, replies.
Paul OYER: When men are deciding who to contact on dating sites, looks matter a great deal. An Illustration of the Pitfalls of Multiple Hypothesis Testing. Now, why did Oyer suddenly turn his attention to online dating?
And, more important, he realized, dating could be much improved if only everybody approached it like an economist would. Now, of course he would say that — he is an economist. But whoever you are, when it comes to online dating, it helps to start with some facts:. A typical study will find that a person with one more year of education holding everything else equal makes 8 to 10 percent more than someone with one fewer year of education. So an overweight person who is otherwise medium attractive will do almost as well as a medium attractive person who is not overweight.
OYER: Men, on the other hand, care a lot less about income. So that makes sense that women should be more attracted to money than men to begin with. Okay, so Paul Oyer knows a good bit about the rules of attraction in online dating — which, if you think about it, is just dating with a much bigger pool and a much better filter. In other words — is he any good at giving actual online dating advice? For instance: how do you build the best profile ever? Is it better to choose a big site like Match.
com or a niche site like GlutenFreeSingles. com which is real? Should you lie — and if so, about what? VOGT: Okay, so it says what are you doing with your life? VOGT: Okay, so like it says the six things I could never do without.
And this is true, but it all ends up sounding like weird bragging. Coffee, whiskey, running shoes, paperbacks, torrents and my geriatric Vespa. I was pretending to know, but I had no idea. VOGT: Oh this is the worst part. What are we looking for here? Someone to hang out with? Option value? New York City is demographically more female than male. We have an oversupply of men relative to women, at least compared to other cities.
New York City and Washington D. tend to swing much more towards more available women. Now the other thing to keep in mind here is time is very much on your side. So you should be picky, you should be looking for a really good match. I should be searching a little less carefully. So Paul Oyer is telling PJ Vogt that PJ is in pretty good shape, dating wise. VOGT: So my friends and I talk about this all the time. My female friends and my male friends all feel that this is true, like that men in New York and in cities where my friends live, everyone can actually feel these market forces and we talk about them.
And I hate them. Like if I were shopping for a TV it would be fun if everyone were clambering for my dollar, but like…Oh that sounds terrible applied to dating. VOGT: Just like the idea that the search sucks even if the search is like weighted in your favor I guess. OYER: Okay, so a couple of things can help you out here. One is if the technology is good enough on the dating site, you want a huge dating site that gives you just a very, very small fraction of the available people on the site.
But just think about a boardwalk. And at one end of the boardwalk is people who are completely incompatible for you, with you for one reason. At the other end of the boardwalk is people who are completely incompatible for you for another reason. OYER: And then think of all the women who might potentially be in your market as being evenly distributed along this boardwalk, where the ones that happen to be right next to you are perfect fits for you, or very good fits for you.
And the ones at the extreme are not. Well, obviously the more women on that boardwalk the better you are. So this is what we call a thick market effect. And it does have the opposite problem that thicker markets lead to more costs of screening all the potential candidates. Now, does that make you nervous? If so, we can help. Coming up on Freakonomics Radio: how to build the best online dating profile ever:.
OYER: As an economist I look at that and I want to suggest the following, that you fill in more detail keeping in mind two ideas that are very important in economics. Justin WOLFERS: The Internet has turned matching upside down. And now you see all the attributes and then you learn about compatibility later. You fill in your ethnicity, body type, diet, religion, income, astrological sign, the pets you love, or hate.
OYER: Okay, so you might not want to reveal that. VOGT: I mean, kind of, honestly. OYER: In some of the questions it asks you how into deep conversations with your mate, and cuddling, and things like that you are. I may have made myself seem a bit more accessible in those dimensions than an honest person would say.
So Paul Oyer admits he fibbed a little bit. And if they send the wrong message, it might be better to tone them down a little bit. So… what kind of signals was PJ Vogt sending out? I said I drink socially, which is stretching it a little bit. I probably drink more than socially. And it says that I speak English okay. They are statistical discrimination and adverse selection.
So one of them is they, they like rich men. I think I have a firm idea of the kind of person who is probably going to like me. Can I throw a little economics jargon at you guys?
AdFind Your Special Someone Online. Choose the Right Dating Site & Start Now! AdCreate an Online Dating Profile for Free! Only Pay When You Want More Features! Make a Free Dating Site Profile! Only Pay When You're Ready to Start Communicating!Services: Dating Sites Comparison · Dating Sites Features · New Reviews · Online DatingTypes: Christian Dating · Senior Dating · All Ages Dating Sites · Gay Dating Sites · Sugar Daddy Dating. Mar 22, A Freakonomics reader (we’ll call her “Sugar Baby”) is documenting her two-week experiment with online “Sugar Daddy Dating”: What You Don’t Know About Online Dating. Season 6, Episode 23 On this week’s episode of Freakonomics Radio: an economist’s guide to dating online. PJ Vogt bravely lets us ... read more
VOGT: Okay, so like it says the six things I could never do without. She got probably 10 times the number of messages that my real profile got. You are canny! Are prediction markets efficient? That she is the worst woman on earth.True story: while listening to your Feb. In the first 24 hours, she got messages. New York City is demographically more female than male. But whoever you are, when it comes to online dating, it helps to start with some facts:. I think that this success in matching quickly, efficiently, and happily freakonomics podcast online dating due to changing the incentives you talk about in your podcast, freakonomics podcast online dating. OYER: What you want to remember in your profile is that you want to be very upfront and forthcoming in anything that is what an economist would call a coordination game.